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Post by warmaker on Feb 3, 2020 11:21:54 GMT -5
This was such an odd situation. Joey feeling like Steven Adler being asked to play Chinese Democracy to stay in the band and the band thinking he is playing like Frank on You Could Be Mine. This whole thing feels like it was completely mismanaged and something that really could and should have been handled behind closed doors with managers. I mean what the fuck are they paying these people for? Honestly, how much prep does Joey need for Walk This Way and a snippet of Livin on the Edge? But why did Joey have to go all sue happy? It's sad that at this stage of the game stupid shit like this has to happen. But then again, we had to have some kind of huge meltdown at the 40th. Why should the 50th be any different? And isn't it just fascinating how it all coincided with two very big events for the band plus the release of a 50th anniversary People edition? It's almost like a band with several decades of experience in press figured out how to manipulate a situation to be essentially harmless yet get their name out there with the likes of Billie Eilish and I don't know, Crack Wacka Flocka Tatoo Face 648x32 to the 5th. Spot on! Everything.... especially this: [...]managers. I mean what the fuck are they paying these people for? Yeah... what do they pay them for? Definitely not for a good band-fans relations management
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Post by bartman2001 on Feb 3, 2020 15:42:21 GMT -5
In all the drama I do believe Joey's stating that he wanted to be a part of something that he's earned playing with the band for 50 years. Obviously I'll never know all of the behind the scenes things going on but I don't think it unreasonable to deduce this. The management clearly shit the bed on this one. The general agreement here is Joey could have done at least the Grammy performance in his sleep. Again I don't think that's an outlandish conclusion to draw. If the band and management came around to this perhaps the drama is averted.
As for his replacement all things considered I think he's done alright. The music cares performance of Dream On sounded good to me. Some of the newer Vegas residency You-Tube videos have had bad sound quality so its hard to measure. But I will say this the chemistry and synergy with the band is much better with Joey behind the kit. His son would be a better temp replacement but if Daddy's gettin' screwed..... All that said for the time being, for me at least, Aerosmith with Douglas' kid behind the kit is better than no Aero at all considering what time the may or may not have left. But yes I hope Joey can return to the fold sooner rather than later.
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Post by pillis on Feb 3, 2020 16:45:06 GMT -5
Also this drummer looks like my evil PHP professor so I'm biased.
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Post by aeroluvr on Feb 4, 2020 2:29:39 GMT -5
All that said for the time being, for me at least, Aerosmith with Douglas' kid behind the kit is better than no Aero at all considering what time the may or may not have left. JD is not Jack Douglas' son. Colin is and he plays percussion for the band.
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Post by bartman2001 on Feb 4, 2020 9:05:42 GMT -5
All that said for the time being, for me at least, Aerosmith with Douglas' kid behind the kit is better than no Aero at all considering what time the may or may not have left. JD is not Jack Douglas' son. Colin is and he plays percussion for the band. The point still comes across: the guy currently filling in for Joey.
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Post by seangod on Feb 4, 2020 14:09:14 GMT -5
I figured this is worth mentioning. Listen to how fast JD is playing this song. I’d have to go back and listen but I don’t think the original is this fast. It sounds out of whack and very rushed to me. Almost frantic. It just does not sound like Aerosmith. It is bad. Who is deciding whether Kramer meets certain standards? If they expect him to play at this guy’s level of speed they are just setting him up for failure. There is no way he is going to be able to play that fast at 70. It’s just not going to happen.
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Post by pillis on Feb 4, 2020 14:16:05 GMT -5
Yes and it's annoyingly fast. It comes accross as a show-off and it's not true to the original record, around 2:50 during the bridge he sounds very different from Joey, this is not Aerosmith they sound like a cover band on drugs. Sorry get rid of this guy, now. It's a joke and offensive. At this point I'm 100% with Joey, after hearing this guy playing like this I think it's ridiculous and if the band is asking Joey to play this fast they can suck it up. Aerosmith has never been about fast playing. This drumming here is ruining all the songs.
Come on almost 70, slower, after a heart surgery, tired and old...he still sounds better. Ok it was a few years ago but I don't think his playing could be THAT BAD now.
Ok so they sound slower in 2017 but here I think they're playing at the original tempo, the video you posted sounds definitely faster even than the original recording and the guitar riff doesn't even sound good at that speed.
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Post by pillis on Feb 4, 2020 14:37:06 GMT -5
OMG what the hell is he even doing?? I can't at how bad the band is sounding these days
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Post by seangod on Feb 4, 2020 15:21:48 GMT -5
Yes and it's annoyingly fast. It comes accross as a show-off and it's not true to the original record, around 2:50 during the bridge he sounds very different from Joey, this is not Aerosmith they sound like a cover band on drugs. Sorry get rid of this guy, now. It's a joke and offensive. At this point I'm 100% with Joey, after hearing this guy playing like this I think it's ridiculous and if the band is asking Joey to play this fast they can suck it up. Aerosmith has never been about fast playing. This drumming here is ruining all the songs. Come on almost 70, slower, after a heart surgery, tired and old...he still sounds better. Ok it was a few years ago but I don't think his playing could be THAT BAD now. Ok so they sound slower in 2017 but here I think they're playing at the original tempo, the video you posted sounds definitely faster even than the original recording and the guitar riff doesn't even sound good at that speed. I couldn't agree more. It's insane.
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Post by bartman2001 on Feb 4, 2020 15:33:10 GMT -5
Complaints that “Toys In The Attic” is being played too fast. I swear to fucking god now I’ve heard it all. I might just have go to church and be debriefed by a priest if I believed in that nonsense. It’s called live music and it ain’t suppose to sound just like the record. Both of the above videos capture the song well and both, to me, are fantastic versions. A couple things first there is no great difference in tempo between the two. Might the JD version be the slightest touch faster? Who knows and who cares that’s the beauty of you guessed it kids LIVE MUSIC. No two performances sound the same nor should they. seangod I truly appreciate your love for Joey, I feel the same about Brad, but the video you posted is probably the best performance I’ve heard from JD via you-tube. That’s the very least I’ve felt the difference of JD”s “style” for a lack of better word and the subtle missing synergy the band has with Joey listening/ watching it.
pillis you continue to and always will confuse the living shit out of me. If I had a nickel or Euro for every time “I’ve heard you complain about them not playing “fast songs” like “Rats” in favor of something mid tempo’d but heavy or slow like “Seasons” I’d have a lot of nickels or Euros!
Nothing personal btw I think you’re both intelligent enough to get that.
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Post by pillis on Feb 4, 2020 15:57:50 GMT -5
No no I'm not looking for the exact same experience I get listening to the studio recordings but changing the tempo that evidently with the original drummer out on hiatus seems very rude and insensitive. Plus it sounds crap the riff doesn't even have time to breathe.
And rats is always good even if a tight slower, seasons is slow by default it's a ballad. I'm very picky and my ears are super sensitive sorry
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Post by seangod on Feb 4, 2020 16:32:56 GMT -5
Complaints that “Toys In The Attic” is being played too fast. I swear to fucking god now I’ve heard it all. I might just have go to church and be debriefed by a priest if I believed in that nonsense. It’s called live music and it ain’t suppose to sound just like the record. Both of the above videos capture the song well and both, to me, are fantastic versions. A couple things first there is no great difference in tempo between the two. Might the JD version be the slightest touch faster? Who knows and who cares that’s the beauty of you guessed it kids LIVE MUSIC. No two performances sound the same nor should they. seangod I truly appreciate your love for Joey, I feel the same about Brad, but the video you posted is probably the best performance I’ve heard from JD via you-tube. That’s the very least I’ve felt the difference of JD”s “style” for a lack of better word and the subtle missing synergy the band has with Joey listening/ watching it.
pillis you continue to and always will confuse the living shit out of me. If I had a nickel or Euro for every time “I’ve heard you complain about them not playing “fast songs” like “Rats” in favor of something mid tempo’d but heavy or slow like “Seasons” I’d have a lot of nickels or Euros!
Nothing personal btw I think you’re both intelligent enough to get that. I get it man. We all have our own opinions. Listen man, I am a drummer. I know tempo. I know speed. Toys is fast. Don't get me wrong. But when something is played too fast, it is frantic, it is rushed. The great Bernard Perdie said it is better to play slow than to play fast for those exact reasons. Even a fast song can be played too fast. Believe me. My only real beef with JD is that his like you said, "style," does not really fit the band. He plays all arms, all fast, all the time. Joey is a groover. Put a feel guy behind the kit- the right replacement- and I think it would be less noticeable. It is all about right replacement. David Hull. Right replacement. The guy is like glue.
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Post by seangod on Feb 4, 2020 16:35:16 GMT -5
No no I'm not looking for the exact same experience I get listening to the studio recordings but changing the tempo that evidently with the original drummer out on hiatus seems very rude and insensitive. Plus it sounds crap the riff doesn't even have time to breathe. And rats is always good even if a tight slower, seasons is slow by default it's a ballad. I'm very picky and my ears are super sensitive sorry Pillis im with you on this one. I have noticed many tempo changes. Things are being played so much faster. I just do not think it is for the better, except for Rats.
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Post by pillis on Feb 4, 2020 17:02:24 GMT -5
No no I'm not looking for the exact same experience I get listening to the studio recordings but changing the tempo that evidently with the original drummer out on hiatus seems very rude and insensitive. Plus it sounds crap the riff doesn't even have time to breathe. And rats is always good even if a tight slower, seasons is slow by default it's a ballad. I'm very picky and my ears are super sensitive sorry Pillis im with you on this one. I have noticed many tempo changes. Things are being played so much faster. I just do not think it is for the better, except for Rats. I'm not a drummer but glad my ears are noticing these things. Or maybe not...I always hear stuff that people don't seem to notice.
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Post by aeroluvr on Feb 5, 2020 3:09:55 GMT -5
My take on his playing. Too fast and "all over the place" on the "top" only, not enough "bottom" in his sound. Too many cymbals that are not clean...in fact some times it seems that is all he is playing is cymbals and it sounds chaotic. This is coming from my ears and my gut, not my own technical ability LOL.
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